Curse

freekedoutfish · Nov 28, 2006, 10:49 AM // 10:49

I simply suggest we allow Heroes to use LightBringers Gaze.

Why?

1. The idea is that they can use any skill we own. Yet they cant use this one.
2. Anet gives us Heroes in Nightfall, incourages us to use them. Then gives us the "realm of torment", but doesnt allow Heroes to use the one KEY skill which you need to kill the mobs.

Im not going to say the "Realm of Torment" is hard, because its not.

But only if you have humans with you who bring Lightbringers gaze.

Otherwise with Heroes (the main feature and selling point of Nightfall) its frustrating and alot harder.

It then discourages you to use them.

We have a spell sitting there, which they could use.

I realise that Hero's dont have titles, so they dont have lightbringer ranks to make lightbringers gaze more effective.

But why cant we allow them to feed off our own lightbringer rank, or give them one which they earn like we do accross the game.

(I suggest letting them feed off ours)

There isnt any real reason why Heroes should not be able to use "lightbringers gaze".

As already mentioned; Heroes can use every other skill which WE have unlocked, but THEY havent. So theres no real logic to the skill Hero skill system anyway.

It wouldnt be a hard thing to change.

[edit] : include the sunspear res sig and any other lightbringer skills which exist.

Taala · Nov 28, 2006, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

As already mentioned; Heroes can use every other skill which WE have unlocked, but THEY havent. So theres no real logic to the skill Hero skill system anyway.

Technically you never unlock Lightbringer's Gaze. Skills get unlocked for PvP characters to use and since the Gaze is only gained from a title for PvE, there's no unlocking. Same thing with Signet of Capture and that sunspear sig.

And for the comment about Gaze being needed for Torment: I didn't even know about Lightbringer's Gaze until I had gone some ways through RoT with henchies, including few master quests. Lightbringer's Gaze just encourages human parties if you want easier time.

Former Ruling · Nov 28, 2006, 03:40 PM // 15:40

Not having the pve-only skills doesn't discourage me from using Heros >_>

Hero > 1000 Pugs using LB Gaze

Taala said the rest.

freekedoutfish · Nov 28, 2006, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Former Ruling

Not having the pve-only skills doesn't discourage me from using Heros >_>

Hero > 1000 Pugs using LB Gaze

Taala said the rest.

The point was more that they incourage us to user Hero's. Its the main selling point to the game. Its the games unique side.

But they limit them from using an (in my opinion) important spell against the hords of abaddon.

The story line is about fighting abaddon, so why not give our Heros, who are meant to stop us "from fighting alone" the ability to use this skill.

It just seems daft to me. But just my view.

Plus you knew that when I said unlocked I meant "bought" or given as a reward for a mission or quest in PvE.

It just shows up as "unlocked" at the skill trader if you have it already, so I used the same terms.

King's Spectre · Nov 28, 2006, 03:51 PM // 15:51

/signed

logan90 · Nov 28, 2006, 04:06 PM // 16:06

/Signed

But it should also be the same for Sunspear Rebirth Signet and the elite lightbringer skill i dont remember the name of.

Elena · Nov 28, 2006, 04:12 PM // 16:12

/signed

this bothered from the moment i got this skill

brosse · Nov 28, 2006, 05:31 PM // 17:31

uhm, r8 Holy Lightbringer => 4*140 holy dmg to 9 targets + 8 dmg reduction + 40% dmg. That doesn't sound a little overpowered to you?

/not signed

Antheus · Nov 28, 2006, 06:04 PM // 18:04

Nah.

Apparently, each and every PUG sucks. They suck so bad, that even gaze doesn't help them.

But, since apparently heroes are teh shiznit, they don't even need gaze. A hero with empty skill bar is better than anything you'll find in PUG. Heroes are the Chuck Norris type of thing, who simply roundhouse kick everything. And Chuck Norris doesn't need Lightbringer gaze, does he.

Gaze is a player only deal. If you want it, do PUGs or other players groups. If you consider every other player sucks, then you don't need gaze in the first place.

freekedoutfish · Nov 28, 2006, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by brosse

uhm, r8 Holy Lightbringer => 4*140 holy dmg to 9 targets + 8 dmg reduction + 40% dmg. That doesn't sound a little overpowered to you?

/not signed

Whats the difference between having:

1 human at rank 8 lighbringer, + 3 heros using the same rank, all bringing gaze and/or the elite skill.

and

8 humans all at rank 8, using gaze and/or elite.

The humans are going to be more overpowered then the heroes, because their can be 8 of them compared to the 4.

We're not talking a combination which is impossible or over-powered. You could get the same strength in a team of all humans or greater.

MithranArkanere · Nov 28, 2006, 10:46 PM // 22:46

Heroes can use all non PvE exclusive skills, not ALL.

They can't use the Sunspear Resurrection Signet.

Heroes are not meant to replace human players, nbut to fill the gaps you may need when forming a party.

kazjun · Nov 28, 2006, 11:18 PM // 23:18

Gaze is to encourage partying with humans, cause really, otherwise all you'd see would be hero/hench parties.

Mind you, gaze is nice, but I'd take my heroes over a random pug most days of the week.

freekedoutfish · Nov 29, 2006, 09:00 AM // 09:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Heroes can use all non PvE exclusive skills, not ALL.

They can't use the Sunspear Resurrection Signet.

Heroes are not meant to replace human players, nbut to fill the gaps you may need when forming a party.

So why then does Anet release an expansion with these hip, new, advanced Heroes. Use it as its selling point (notice them all in the advertisements), and its unique feature over factions and tyria....

....only to later do something so obviously to discourage us from using them in the realm of torment.

As I've already said too; The Heroes are this intregral part of the storyline, to fight against the hords of abaddon. To me, it just makes no sense to not atleast give them lightbringers gaze.

Some may say that it doesnt make a huge difference if they dont have it. Thats true. You can still fight your away through most of the Realm of torment and the rest of the game without it. But there is an obvious difference when playing in the ROT when most of your team has LG. Its less frustrating and more enjoyable.

I like the ROT, but when its you, heroes and henches, it is noticeably more hard and frustrating. Its less fun because you spend most of it at -60dp, picking things off one at a time.

You cant tell me that everytime you want to set foot outside of a camp in the ROT we should have to spend 30 minutes getting a human team together just to ensure they all have LG.

For missions im willing to do that. For the masters quests Im willing to do that. But if im just farming or doing a bog-standard quest, I dont want to have to spend 30 minutes building a human team just to get LG in it.

Thats just unreasonable and its forcing us to play in ways we may not choose too.

You'l also have people saying it will make hero parties over powered; ive said earlier this is just wrong. A human team with 8 players all equipped with LG is going to be far more powerfull then a team of 1 human, 3 heroes and 4 henches, because only 5 would have LFG.

There isnt any real reason we cant have Heroes using LFG. It makes more sense in the storyline to let them.

MithranArkanere · Nov 30, 2006, 04:02 AM // 04:02

I don't need Gaze in my Heroes.

I can beat hordes of margnites with my W,MM, Mo hero team.

You can too, this is GW. If one can, all can.

The main reason is that Lightbringer's Gaze is a Playing Characters only skill.
Gave to a character, not to an account, and meant to be used by a human character.
It only works in few creatures too. You can't use it with Menzies fellas in fissure or Dhuum guys in Thomb of the kings.

Sli Ander · Nov 30, 2006, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

But, since apparently heroes are teh shiznit, they don't even need gaze. A hero with empty skill bar is better than anything you'll find in PUG. Heroes are the Chuck Norris type of thing, who simply roundhouse kick everything. And Chuck Norris doesn't need Lightbringer gaze, does he.

Gaze is a player only deal. If you want it, do PUGs or other players groups. If you consider every other player sucks, then you don't need gaze in the first place.

I am very very sorry, but I have to say it.
Chuck Norris doesn't use Lightbringer's Gaze, Lightbringers use Chuck Norris' Gaze.
Bad jokes aside, Antheus is right that it is a player skill. If you remember Prophecies(oh so long ago), the selling point of the game was that YOU are the hero. YOU stand in front of the henchies in a cutscene and speak. YOU are the great savior of the world. Not the henchies/heroes. YOU are the Sunspear General, Koss just helps you put on your armor.

From the viewpoint of an epic rpg, you are the lead character with special abilities. The npc's are cool guys who get to help the legendary hero to his place in the history books. While I'm sure it would be nice to allow Heroes a limited use of the Res signet(dependent on their level perhaps?), giving them a skill which could possibly be used as brosse said: overpowered.

If you can equip this great skill to npcs that you control, then you also have no reason to group with other players. If you want to mow down the baddies with mass Gaze, take humans. As others have said, they've made do without(heroes with gaze that is) and not seen much of a difference.
I've put in my opinion from my limited knowledge, but I'll refrain from signing or /unsigning as I do not own nightfall and do not feel I should get a vote on something that does not affect me.

But you get my two cents anyway